[Coral-List] Proliferation of Acropora prolifera

Greer, Lisa GreerL at wlu.edu
Sat Sep 7 21:32:06 EDT 2013 

To follow this thread...

After prompting by Vassil, 
I looked through a few hundred A. cervicornis samples from the Enriquillo Valley and have yet to find any with a morphology suggestive of the A. prolifera specimens I have seen live and in photos. 
 

Lisa Greer
Associate Professor
Geology Department
Washington and Lee University
Lexington, VA  24450
(540) 458-8870
greerl at wlu.edu
________________________________________
From: coral-list-bounces at coral.aoml.noaa.gov [coral-list-bounces at coral.aoml..noaa.gov] on behalf of Dennis Hubbard [dennis.hubbard at oberlin.edu]
Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 1:20 PM
To: vassil zlatarski
Cc: Coral -List
Subject: Re: [Coral-List] Proliferation of Acropora prolifera

Vassil et al.

I have never seen anything that I'd swear was fossil *prolifera* in
outcrop, but I have seen plenty of *cervicornis* and *palmata*. However, I
must admit that I wasn't looking that close at the "*cervicornis*" to see
if there were aberrant morphologies. There are cases in the Holocene of
western DR (Lago Enriquillo) where the morphologies are highly varied,
However, I'd attribute that more to varying environmental conditions than
hybridization.

In cores it is much tougher as the stick-like morphology makes recovery
with a rotary drilling system difficult. When you do get recovery, it's a
broken stock and I'm not a good enough taxonomist to tell the difference in
just a straight 10-cm section.

Having said this, the short answer is, "I don't think so".

Dennis


On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 1:08 PM, vassil zlatarski <vzlatarski at yahoo.com>wrote:

> Hi Dennis,
>
> Nothing unusual, what is bothering you?
>
> Would you, please, tell if you found fossil A. prolifera?  Thanks in
> advance!
>
> Cheers,
>
> Vassil
>
>
> 131 Fales Rd., Bristol, RI 02809, USA; tel.: +1-401-254-5121
>
>   ------------------------------
>  *From:* "frahome at yahoo.com" <frahome at yahoo.com>
> *To:* "coral-list at coral.aoml.noaa.gov" <coral-list at coral.aoml.noaa.gov>
> *Sent:* Friday, September 6, 2013 10:06 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [Coral-List] A World without Coral Reefs?
>
> If somehow we could manage to keep
> moving the crushing economic machine in spite of everything, we would get
> probably easily used to a world without coral reefs as we did to a sea
> without
> big fishes, a land without forests and wildlife, rivers without clean
> waters
> etc.
>
> How many do even
> know there was a forest where most of our monocultures grow or cities lay
> nowadays. Give it one or two generations and coral reefs could be forgotten
> too. Algae ecosystems are still nicer than monocultures or shopping malls
> and
> car parks after all.
>
> Bad jokes aside, the only hope lies in the fact
> that the machine is choking, and it is chocking because billing time is
> approaching. But until we try to cure it with the same recipe and mindset
> we have used to drive it, I doubt we will make any progress.
>
> Francesca
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Dennis Hubbard <dennis.hubbard at oberlin.edu>
> To: Phillip Dustan <phil.dustan at gmail.com>
> Cc: "coral-list at coral.aoml.noaa.gov" <coral-list at coral.aoml.noaa.gov>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 3, 2013 5:30 PM
> Subject: Re: [Coral-List] A World without Coral Reefs?
>
>
> Phil:
>
> Wow, what a great poster! Do you have this in a Powerpoint format or
> something else where I could show the slides to a class? The resolution
> would not hold up from the jpg.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Dennis
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 3, 2013 at 9:15 AM, Phillip Dustan <phil.dustan at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Dear Dennis,
> >  Your post reminded me of a poster I assembled in 2004 based on Sir
> > Nicholas Nuttalls campaign to save the groupers in the Bahamas. He used
> > "Imagine the Bahamas without grouper" which I turned into  Imagine the
> Keys
> > without corals?
> > Sad to say it's just about happened................
> >  Here's the Dropbox url
> >
> >
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/dbe9u1a2a6cxnsh/Imagine%20the%20Keys%20without%20corals%20poster.jpg
> >
> > All the best
> >   Phil
> >
> >
> > *"When one tugs at a single thing in nature *
> > *he finds it attached to the rest of the world."*
> > *   John Muir*
> >
> > Phillip Dustan PhD
> > Department of Biology
> > College of Charleston, SC
> > Charleston SC  29424
> > 843-953-8086 office
> > 843-224-3321 (mobile)
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 12:31 PM, Dennis Hubbard <
> > dennis.hubbard at oberlin.edu> wrote:
> >
> >> Steve raises an important point that I've been wrestling with for the
> past
> >> five years or so every time I convene my *Biology, Geology and Politics
> of
> >> Coral Reefs* course; at least one student has asked me this very
> question
> >> every time I teach it.
> >>
> >> If my understanding of the consensus is correct, even in the most
> >> optimistic of scenarios (a 50% reduction of 1990 emissions levels by
> early
> >> to mid century), we'll be seeing CO2 levels at least in the mid-400s and
> >> then will probably not see numbers below that in the lifetime of our
> >> youngest contributor.
> >>
> >> I wouldn't advocate for just "facing reality" as this makes it too easy
> >> for
> >> anyone to use this as an excuse to do nothing - and many of the proposed
> >> measures will probably have at least collateral environmental benefits
> >> even
> >> if
> >> corals aren't among the recipients. So, I would ask a modified version
> of
> >> Steve's question. If we do feel that reefs as we know (knew?) them are
> not
> >> likely in the future, then 1) how do we either triage what to save (I
> >> argue
> >> against this as it's the same hubris that got us to this point), or 2)
> how
> >> do we determine a strategy that focuses on the things that are most
> likely
> >> to be key ecological elements in the future (note, I use the word
> >> "elements" in favor of "species" on purpose).
> >>
> >> Just to make a wild projection.... we won't reach consensus.
> >>
> >> Dennis
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sat, Aug 31, 2013 at 3:13 PM, Steve Mussman <sealab at earthlink.net>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> >    Dear Listers,
> >> >    I hate to put this out there, but I'm beginning to wonder if I've
> >> been
> >> >    kidding myself.
> >> >    I've been collaborating with others in an effort to urge the diving
> >> > industry
> >> >    to openly address the issue of local and global threats to coral
> >> reefs
> >> >    including an honest assessment of the pending impacts of climate
> >> > change. In
> >> >    doing  so  I've  found  it necessary to tread carefully in that
> >> strong
> >> >    resistance remains intact throughout the industry at just the
> mention
> >> > of the
> >> >    term climate change.
> >> >    But that's not really my focus at this point. What I want to know
> is
> >> > this:
> >> >    Are efforts to forestall or mitigate the impacts of climate change
> on
> >> > coral
> >> >    reef ecosystems already past the point being practical? Are efforts
> >> like
> >> >    last  year's  consensus  statement  from  the  ICRS  just based on
> >> the
> >> >    institutional inertia of conservationists who value hope over truth
> >> and
> >> >    scientists who can't see the reefs for the corals? Am I (are we)
> >> > spreading
> >> >    false beliefs and misdirecting efforts by persisting that coral
> reefs
> >> > have a
> >> >    future rather than urging that we begin to address the greater
> >> fallout
> >> > from
> >> >    their inevitable collapse?
> >> >    I'm honestly beginning to wonder.
> >> >    Regards,
> >> >     Steve
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Coral-List mailing list
> >> > Coral-List at coral.aoml.noaa.gov
> >> > http://coral.aoml.noaa.gov/mailman/listinfo/coral-list
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Dennis Hubbard
> >> Chair, Dept of Geology-Oberlin College Oberlin OH 44074
> >> (440) 775-8346
> >>
> >> * "When you get on the wrong train.... every stop is the wrong stop"*
> >>  Benjamin Stein: "*Ludes, A Ballad of the Drug and the Dream*"
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Coral-List mailing list
> >> Coral-List at coral.aoml.noaa.gov
> >> http://coral.aoml.noaa.gov/mailman/listinfo/coral-list
> >>
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Dennis Hubbard
> Chair, Dept of Geology-Oberlin College Oberlin OH 44074
> (440) 775-8346
>
> * "When you get on the wrong train.... every stop is the wrong stop"*
> Benjamin Stein: "*Ludes, A Ballad of the Drug and the Dream*"
> _______________________________________________
> Coral-List mailing list
> Coral-List at coral.aoml.noaa.gov
> http://coral.aoml.noaa.gov/mailman/listinfo/coral-list
> _______________________________________________
> Coral-List mailing list
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> http://coral.aoml.noaa.gov/mailman/listinfo/coral-list
>
>


--
Dennis Hubbard
Chair, Dept of Geology-Oberlin College Oberlin OH 44074
(440) 775-8346

* "When you get on the wrong train.... every stop is the wrong stop"*
 Benjamin Stein: "*Ludes, A Ballad of the Drug and the Dream*"
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